Curse

BryanM · Feb 24, 2007, 10:32 PM // 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by some people

waaaaaah waaaaah someone has an opinion that differs from mine! pweaseeeee stoppp it ideas hurt my little brain!

Anyway, how's everyone doing on the Challenge Mission Ladder?

Edit:

Think I come off as too much as a jerk here. I just don't appreciate people going out of their way to say someone is whining when trying to discuss something.

This is whining -> "Oh noes I got banned for using a bot! WTF WTF WTF."
This is not -> "It would be nice if we could change our second class without having to map."

Please adjust your whine detectors accordingly.

lyra_song · Feb 25, 2007, 12:52 AM // 00:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanM

Precisely, missions (challenge and normal) are the point of PvE. Prophecies was convenient in the sense you could just walk to the desert, play the two missions there that have a little challenge to them, and most of the game was behind you. Thunderhead, and you've got the skills guy offering you all the skills. When they updated him to do that, of course. Having to look up where to go to buy one wasn't cool.

The prophecies map layout is very convenient. its easy and for the most part, it is fun. But lets face it. Why would you ever do older missions ever after that? It makes the rest of the game just a waste of space.

You say you wanna help your friends with other characters. How could you if you skipped those missions? Skip to the end, and skip all the content.

Getting to the end is not the point. For me, its the journey and not the destination.

BryanM · Feb 25, 2007, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by lyra_song

Why would you ever do older missions ever after that?

Skill points and protector titles.

Wish the earlier missions would give skill points for foreigners, but that is a tangent I guess.

Tempy · Feb 25, 2007, 01:58 AM // 01:58

Okay yes so MY BAD for making and wanting to play all the professions and learn their little nuances. However, just because a NEW GAME comes out, it does not mean I lose the ability to play my ESTABLISHED character well. I will say These things once again...

1. THIS IS NOT ABOUT NEW CHARACTERS...this is about established charas for long time players (who are dwindling quickly because of the boring grind (PvE), and the lack of PvP fixes.)

2. Agreed that the characters are different, but I (the player) know the storyline and have been through it a minimum of once. Even IF(and that is a BIG IF) the community was actually RP, I as a person with a memory and somewhat decent grasp on imagination and continuity would be able to blend my established character into ANY outpost or situation in the storyline.

3. NO ONE would be forced to use the unlocked areas. If you wanted to play every mission and quest that would, still be open to you. However, it would give those that didn’t want to do that the OPTION to not do it, once they met the requirements to do so.

4. Opened/unlocked does not mean complete…Missions and quests would not automatically be complete.

Suggestions/Requirments to implement this and reasons it would help.

1. At least one chara has to have completed the campaign.

Now the fun part.

2. As a second chara opens a REPEAT outpost/town it unlocks for charas that meet age/exp requirements. (Repeat being just because I rushed one chara through on primary missions only doesn’t mean I found, Port Sledge. Not unlocked on at least 2 charas NOT open for all.)

Age/Exp Requirements for unlock

(all numbers really just pulled out…but it seems to be a standard time area for chara understanding….LOL, for most.)

Chara must be a minimum of Level 20 and have all of the following

1. 200 Hours Old of PLAY time (yes this can be reached afk, thus the reason for the next requirement)
2. 700,000 Experience Points

Yes People will still find away around them, but at least they would have to work a bit at it, especially with “running” taken out of Factions and Nightfall.

Examples

Illusiona~ Monk [P] (DID all core 2ndry profession quests, had to buy new ones like everyone else[would have preferred a quest])
1,290 Hours Old (21 Months)
4,134,534 experience points

Completed all 3 campaigns…(full storyline including all quests in Proph and Factions, 3 to go in DoT, Leveled all of the Heroes except Razah)
GMC of Tyria
98.4% Canthan
99.6% Elona

291 Elite Skills Capped

Protector of Tyria…blah, blah, blah (various other titles)

Sorcha~Necro [P] (DID all core 2ndry profession quests, had to buy new ones like everyone else[would have preferred a quest])
299 Hours Old (17 months)
1,440,481 Exp

Completed Prophecies and Factions in SunSpear Sanctuary (with LOW LEVEL heroes because I brought her across in the first few days of NF)

Lustra~Dervish [NF]
203 Hours Old (3 Months)
754,093 Exp

Completed NF First (full storyline including all quests), in Augury Rock

Siobhan~Paragon [NF]
12 Hours Old (31 Days) [Level 8]
28,730 Exp

Sitting idle tired of farming for Sunspear Points

Chimera~Sin [F]
28 Hours Old (13 Days)
155,761 Exp

Completed “Noob Island”, Jumped to NF sitting on Docks with Level 15 Heroes.

Sorcha(as well as any other established chara) would have access to the areas in NF because Lustra AND Illusiona have opened them up. Same way Lustra would have access to Prophecies and Factions because Sorcha and Illusiona opened them up before her.

Siobhan and Chimera, WOULD NOT have access as they don’t meet all of the requirements.

Reasons it would help.

1. People could use any of their established charas in any town or mission. No more sorry only my dervish is that far. Which could breathe new life into the comatose PUG.
2. More playablity, for the simple fact as it gives more choices.
3. Would bridge a bit more of the gap felt between PvP and PvE. The rift exsists because they are supposedly 2 different beasts and yet they are not. Both sides think the other side has it easy, therefore getting preference.

*slips on flame resistant armor and stands next to the lake* Let the flames begin, but instead of giving the BS that that is how its supposed to be, or it would just make things too easy, think outside the norm, and try and see where long time players are coming from and sadly going to…give us a reason to want to play, not make us play to get to someplace we’ve been before. You say its easy enough to do with time…just because its easy doesn’t mean we should have to keep doing it over and over and over again.

Burst Cancel · Feb 25, 2007, 02:22 AM // 02:22

The PvE vs. PvP argument has never worked, because they are fundamentally different modes of play with fundamentally different requirements and objectives. PvP is about skill-based competition, which requires a level playing field. In fact, I've always thought that the entire concept of unlocking anything for PvP to be misguided. Fighting games don't require their players to 'unlock' special moves. FPS don't require their players to unlock weapons or abilities. RTS don't require their players to unlock units. The entire basis of competition is that all players start every game with identical tools and equal access to additional tools.

PvE in its current form cannot function under the mechanic described above without trivializing itself. If anything I do on one PvE character is automatically transferred to all PvE characters, I only have the incentive to play the game once, no matter how many additional characters I have. We can limit the types of achievements transferred - maybe only towns, or only skill, etc. but this doesn't change the basic argument: PvE is about having things to do, and the more you transfer between characters, the less there is to do, and the shorter PvE becomes.

CagedinSanity · Feb 25, 2007, 02:30 AM // 02:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eilsys

I'm not sure if I agree with merging PVE titles... I mean, that's what distinguishes your characters, right?

Not as much, i think *all* 8 of my characters have some Sunspear title. Even my prophecies MM, level 12, has that blasted commander title.

Still, I don't support merging PvE titles. Pointless.

Oren The Destroyer · Feb 25, 2007, 02:36 AM // 02:36

(probably stated already, but I honestly dont want to read through 7 pages...)
If you dont want to take all of your characters through the campaign, dont make so many characters...

Tempy · Feb 25, 2007, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oren The Destroyer

(probably stated already, but I honestly dont want to read through 7 pages...)
If you dont want to take all of your characters through the campaign, dont make so many characters...

If you don't want to read though the discussion then don't reply...same concept as you just threw out about the characters.

Last I checked this was a forum to DISCUSS things, and maybe just maybe come up with something constuctive and helpful.

Phantomice · Feb 25, 2007, 02:48 AM // 02:48

What is this about merging titles that not what this is about this thread is about nor is it about new chars either. this thread is about grinding through the game with 10 chars and not having to do so. why is it that people are hung up on the new chars and merging titles anyway. please if you have something to contribute to this thread then post but by all means please don't post if you don't have or cant contribute to the thread.

Yosh · Feb 25, 2007, 02:50 AM // 02:50

Little harsh. Even though what she said was stated like 46 times. Anyway the title/map system is fine how it is. If you dont want to replay the game, then dont. Focus on 1 charecter thats extremely good. Or PvP.

Phantomice · Feb 25, 2007, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yosh

Little harsh. Even though what she said was stated like 46 times. Anyway the title/map system is fine how it is. If you dont want to replay the game, then dont. Focus on 1 charecter thats extremely good. Or PvP.

Then why did Anet give us 4 char slot to begin with then 2 or 3 chars slots with each new chapter.

and also the ability to buy more char slots through the Guild Wars Store.

Yosh · Feb 25, 2007, 02:58 AM // 02:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantomice

Then why did Anet give us 4 char slot to begin with then 2 or 3 chars slots with each new chapter.

and also the ability to buy more char slots through the Guild Wars Store.

So that the people who dont mind playing the game can make a few good charecters. I was just suggesting what people who are to lazy to do that game again should do.

BryanM · Feb 25, 2007, 03:34 AM // 03:34

The titles deal was in the OP, that I vaguely remember, Phan. There are some that should be account based. The Wisdom title, for example, encourages you to pool all your orange items to one character. Then if you want to expert salvage stuff, you pass that stuff to that character, too.

The game encourages you to ignore the PvE grind after a very short period of time. PvP is where character flexibility exists, and account titles are a permanent thing.

Everyone in this thread has agreed, yes, that the game is currently designed so you won't play more than a couple guys.

The people who think this is a good thing, I (and you, it seems) feel are wrong.

Personally I'd rather hop on a treadmill that goes somewhere.

That they only offered 4 slots was clearly only to help force people into buying the expansions.

If they allowed the primary class to be changed, yeah it would make this "whining" moot. It would also be extraordinarily odd and lame - wildly different character graphics and such. Hence all the "outpost unlock" talk, as the least lame way to reconcile this.

Do I ever expect the developers to acknowledge the arcade-y style of the game and implement this option? No. Do I expect a massive reform of the item system and statistics to make them more interesting? No. Do I expect the trade house before the next campaign comes out? Ooooof course not.

All I want is them to know this is how I feel about this game. If they would actually even acknowledge the idea, that might even make me continue being a customer. A guildmate encouraged me to go ahead with the last two campaigns, but I just have a limit to how much redundant banality I can take.

Domino · Feb 25, 2007, 08:35 AM // 08:35

I think it encourages players to spend time and energy on one or two primary characters.

I have one Assassin and a Necromancer that are my "primary" characters... I've explored most of ALL 3 continents with these characters, done almost all of the quests... got hats/minipets/15k for both

Characters are supposed to be separate entities when it comes to titles and what they have access to. Please A-net, keep it this way.

If anything... make it HARDER for people to get to level 20, it's too easy as it is. No one should be running around with 12 characters if you ask me.

Meat Axe · Feb 25, 2007, 09:09 AM // 09:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanM

Personally I'd rather hop on a treadmill that goes somewhere.

If you want a treadmill that goes somewhere, maybe you should go outside and run around, or buy a bike. You don't need a number of bikes. Just one will do, and it will be enjoyable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempy

PvP SHOULD be account based and PvE chara based....WHY?????? Because that's how its always been....wrong. Not exactly "balanced" throughout the game that PvP gets things handed to them and they can use them for 2 min old charas....but some PvE players have 1200 hour old charas that are FORCED to play through again to cap a skill...Arguement...THEN DON'T MAKE ANOTHER CHARA...easy said for someone that PvP's you can make a new chara at ANY TIME and not lose anything!!!!

Uhhh... I don't PvP and I say you shouldn't make so many characters. Also, PvP players have a large restriction that PvE players don't. PvP only characters are just that. They can only play PvP, which is why they can buy skill packs. PvE players can do both.

I can see why some people want this added. I mean, I wouldn't want to play the game over and over. However, I don't like having more than one or two characters. But I think the idea that all outposts suddenly appear on all your characters' maps once you've finished the campaign is insane. However, maybe instead of making players play through all missions again (in the case of Factions and Nightfall) they maybe should make the continent runable once you've finished it with one character. But to play missions you either have to play from the start or join a group that has played from the start. This would mean that there is still some effort for second or third or fourth etc characters, but it would mean they wouldn't be getting completely bored with the game.

Tiny Killer · Feb 25, 2007, 10:32 AM // 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantomice

Then why did Anet give us 4 char slot to begin with then 2 or 3 chars slots with each new chapter.

and also the ability to buy more char slots through the Guild Wars Store.

That would be your "improved storage system".

Bryant Again · Feb 25, 2007, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiny Killer

That would be your "improved storage system".

Hah, just like how the party search was our "improved trade system". Nice.

Phantomice · Feb 25, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

Very true about the storage and party search.

BryanM · Feb 25, 2007, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meat Axe

If you want a treadmill that goes somewhere, maybe you should play any of the Diablo games, WoW, or wait for Hellgate: London

Fixed~~~~ A+++

Though I do like cycling, it's hard to live somewhere that's a safe activity to do. Suicidal in the city streets; dirt roads here have a load of rocks all up in them. Going in a circle at the park is about as much fun as walking around in circles on your property... just not quite as much.

How about that Critical Chop, eh? Coolest form of power creep ever while it was up there, or what?

lyra_song · Feb 25, 2007, 06:59 PM // 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meat Axe

If you want a treadmill that goes somewhere, maybe you should play any of the Diablo games, WoW, or wait for Hellgate: London

Fixed~~~~ A+++

You need to stop editing quotes like that. It borders on flaming and is rather inapproriate to the discussion.

While Guild Wars is time consuming through quests and mission, other MMOs are time consuming through leveling up.

Those treadmills don't go anywhere. It gives you an illusion of progress.

If a player enjoys leveling up as the majority of their gameplay, instead of actual content, then i guess that works for them. But thats not how Guild Wars works.

If anything. Anet needs to add better incentives to continue playing through the game with more characters. Click clicky.